If You Came Here Via Planet Preterist
Filed Under (Roderick's Posts, bluejays, cults/cultic, emergent, ethics, harassment, history, hyperpreterism) by Roderick_E on 19-05-2009
Tagged Under : dishonest tactics, planet preterist, Virgil Vaduva
If you have arrived on this site via some link from Planet Preterist, then to you I say welcome & now you will be able to get the truth.
After 15 years as a “full preterist”, I Roderick Edwards in late 2007 renounced that belief as I saw it less & less compatible with biblical, historic Christianity. Sure, it seems to answer some of the “Left Behindism” that has been plaguing the Church for the last 40 years, but historic Christianity has ALWAYS been opposed to “Left Behindism”.
In about 1999-2000, I began to really see much of the “full preterist” movement as corrupt & corrupting — ever moving more & more into liberalism & even functional atheism especially the group that is led by Virgil Vaduva of Planet Preterist. Vaduva was & still is constantly trying to marry the “full preterist” movement with the Postmodern/Emergent movement & even advocates a vague form of Universalism (everyone is saved). During the last few years of my time within the movement, I spent a lot of time trying to steer it away from its liberal decline. There were times I was ready to just give up but I kept telling myself, “If only we can keep it conservative”, but after a while I seen that “full preterism” is inherently liberal — I mean it has to be. It claims 2000 years worth of Christian interpretation is in error. What could be more liberal than that?
So, during my transition between accepting & rejecting what I would come to realize is actually HYPER-PRETERISM (since hyper means to go beyond the original intent & scope), many of my writings at the time may seem contradictory. Yet, many hyper-preterists attempt to use my writings from that period to imply I was in confusion. But what is worse yet, there are some hyper-preterists, like Vaduva who use material I wrote as a hyper-preterist & yet he doesn’t tell his unsuspecting readers that I am no longer a hyper-preterist. Very dishonest of him. He has done this also with former hyper-preterists who have renounced religion altogether & became atheists (such as Jared Coleman, a former co-admin of Planet Preterist). Compounding the unethical behavior, Vaduva continues to utilize my material even though I asked him repeatedly to remove ALL of my material from his website. Further, he lets people think I have threatened him with legal action, which I never have.
Anyhow, I welcome you reader to the truth & please feel free to use the contact link to send me a message or ask a question. You aren’t going to get the truth from people like Vaduva. He has shown to be completely unethical & untrustworthy.
For more on my departure from the hyper-preterist movement, follow these links:
Roderick, are you the same Roderick that participated in one of those preterist web sites that was moderated by Edward Stevens (I think)? I dropped off the site about 2 yrs ago since more and more it seemed that those on the site always seemed to drift off to weird stuff. If you think you might be the same individual, I am curious as to what specific points regarding preterism you now feel differently about? Thanks, Jim
Hi there Jim, I’d imagine I would be the same guy, since I don’t think there is any other Roderick that had been part of that movement.
You are asking for a tall order for me to address specific points which I now differ, but let me start this way.
How do we reconcile these things:
Hyper-preterism MUST begin by claiming 2000 years worth of Christianity has been junk. This is the reason why Ed Stevens tried to claim there was a 1st-century rapture. He thought he could reconcile the problem of hyper-preterism by removing what he called the “1st-rank Christians” from the face of the planet, leaving behind only the so-called “2nd-rank Christians” whom Stevens claims didn’t know about the supposed rapture/Parousia & therein Stevens thinks he can explain why Christianity has NEVER advocated the things hyper-preterists now claim. Do you realize what this does to sanctification???? How in the world is there 1st & 2nd rank Christians? Can someone be an “almost Christian”? but not enough to warrant going to heaven? Stevens is willing to destroy the salvific model to advance his warped eschatologucal paradigm.
Jim, I have abandoned hyper-preterism & would love to talk to you more about it, here or in email: rodericke@sbcglobal.net
I cannot believe (well actually I can) that “Pastor” Samuel Frost is over there defending this unethical use of another person’s work. Samuel says that if PP were to honour Roderick’s request to pull his work that would mean that every request anyone could make upon a person should be honoured; such as my personal opinion that Samuel has no business being a teacher while in unrepentant sin. That is beyond ridiculous.
Asking someone to repent (ask something of them that is theirs to give) and asking someone to remove one’s material (something that belongs to the asker to begin with) are nowhere even remotely the same.
Another person tried to justify what PP was doing by claiming that all authors gave up their rights by posting articles there due to a copyright notice at the bottom of the page. I am no intellectual property expert, and certainly no lawyer, but that also seems patently ridiculous. Here is how I believe the law would see it. A limited grant of voluntary copyright is given to that site by the author that can be withdrawn. One cannot irrevocably gives up one’s rights without an explicit agreement, and a notice at the bottom of the page that is intended for READERS and not WRITERS will not cut it, especially considering that the writers there were not renumerated for their work.
What PP is doing is absolutely wrong and unethical and typical of the slimy moves that some hyperpreterists pull with their opposition. And once again “Pastor” Samuel Frost is on the scene to defend it. But then again he was comfortable embracing as “brothers” all manner of outlandish views that he thinks he can brush off of himself by vaguely referring to them as “out in left field” to his conservative friends. He doesn’t define what “out in left field” precisely means, but it seems at least one HP at SGP isn’t buying it and said that Christ was blasphemed at that conference.
There are times when some people say that we shouldn’t focus on these breaches of ethics but merely refute them exegetically. I have a whole site of articles refuting them exegetically; we do not have to reinvent the wheel. Exposing the bad fruit reveals the poisonous tree. Especially from a site that claims to be emergent and having a “missional mindset.” I guess if being missional means being a thug.
David Green, I know you read here occasionally; that is what your star author is doing. Not only calls evil good but approves of those who do the same.
And for you SGPers who think that I was off-base to find the locking of the compound fishy; perhaps you will also defend Patrick Madrid’s closing of his forum which was just blasted on Dr. James White’s site and appropriately called “turtling” once comments over there were being subjected to criticism.
Oh and hi Jim, nice to meet you. After you post here a few times, the posts will get recognized by the system and go up without moderation. Everyone’s first few posts are moderated since (big surprise), there were some hyperpreterists in the past that could not help themselves but to come over here and play the fool. (to the few recent hyperpreterists that have been posting here, I am not referring to you guys, but pretty specifically to Jason Bradfield and Michael Bennett). Jason once posted repetitively about twenty times one night and refused to stop. So unfortunately, I have to moderate comments from posters who are not yet established in good standing.
Mike Loomis, your post will not be approved. You are not going to come here with vague accusations against Roderick referring in general to “the Internet Archive.” If you have something to accuse, do it specifically as we do. And first, try to handle it in private with Roderick. That is the way things are done.
Hello Jim, it is nice to have you visit the blog. You will find that Dee Dee is a very gracious host.
Mike Loomis (aka psychomike) the HYPER-preterist is on CARM doing whatever he can to promote this heresy & now he comes here & wants to object to the content of what I presented above. He gives no specific objection, just a vague insinuation that I have not been honest. Well, you know what Mike, you hyperprets can think I’m a jerk or whatever, but I ALWAYS tried to be honest. So if you have something specific to say, email me but don’t come here & try to drop the same old weaselly hyperpret implications without documentation.
I would have gladly let Mike’s comment through if he said something specific rather than “go check the whole internet” which is basically what he said to do. Mike and I have had cordial emails in the past, but I am not going to allow someone to come here and accuse someone of lying without backing up that accusation.
It is really twisted that Samuel is backing up Virgil on this when Samuel puts a copyright notice on each and every email. It is really twisted that fellow “emergents” aren’t taking Virgil to task for his definitely UN-missional behaviour, not to mention his continued very inappropriate behaviour towards me assuming a confidence and permission that he does not have. It is a stupid little power trip. But “pastor” Samuel has to be everything to everyone, including even those that by the most liberal standards would even be heretics to hyperpreterists. Where is Jason and Michael? What about David Green?
David, there is no way you can keep living under the illusion that you have that Samuel has cut associations with the “left fielders.” Samuel has to keep up pretenses so much that he won’t even say what the “left field” teachings were, but is joyfully allowing Virgil to represent that this was a gathering of “brothers.”
APPENDIX: Vaduva is now trying to say that he kicked me off Planet Putrid & that is what caused me to morph into the Rush Limbaugh against Hyperpreterism. Actually once again Vaduva is a LIAR!!!!!!!
I originally LEFT on my own because of the continual promotion of Emergent/Postmodernism & vague universalism, on top of Vaduva’s constant attack on Reformed Theology. Then, Vaduva begged me to come back, promising things would be different. Well, they weren’t different & I continued to oppose what he was doing & then yes he did eventually ban me. YAY!!! I’m so glad. It was my first step at getting out of that cult. Yet for a few more years I attempted to fool myself into thinking the “movement” could be made more conservative. It became apparent that the flaws in the “movement” were actually inherent in its very core & premises. By 2007, I’d left hyperpreterism completely. THANK THE LORD!!! All this time, Dee Dee had interacted with me & sometimes I would behave a bit like a snake as is typical with hyperpreterists. She & her friends didn’t give up on me & continued their prayers AND uncompromising stance that hyperpreterism is heresy.
Today, a hyperpreterist guy named John Hedges, typical of hyperpreterist behavior attempted to psycho-analyze me. He had this to say:
Notice first how this guy DOESN’T cite or source ANYTHING. If nothing else, readers of Pretblog KNOW we cite & source as much as possible so you can go read the full context for yourselves.
BACK STORY
Everything has a back story & here is the back story with Mr. Hedges. During the time I was opposing the liberal element of hyperpreterism, Hedges was right there with me. At one time Hedges even excitedly showed me where he purchased the domain virgilvaduva.com & wanted to know if he & I could start a site about Vaduva. I declined & told him that action is not appropriate. This happened while I was STILL a hyperpret. (Remember this John???). Hedges would call me almost every day on the phone (sometimes more than once a day). While I was a hyperpret, Hedges was perhaps the closest thing I had as a “follower” (not that I wanted one). One day, Hedges told me his friend hyperpreterist Ward Fenely wanted me to speak at some conference he was going to hold. I was hesitant on many levels, but eventually agreed. During the lead up time to the conference, Hedges was upset because Fenely didn’t seek Hedges participation. This particularly stung Hedges since Hedges had participated in the past & I believe he thought Fenely was giving him the cold shoulder. After finding out more about Fenely & his organization (ironically from Hedges himself), I politely retracted the agreement citing an equally limiting situation of being too new at my employment to take the time off. Not too long after that, Hedges was suddenly asked to speak at the conference instead. Ever since that day, Hedges has been increasingly hostile towards me including participating in a threat to harm my wife & child unless I shut up.
Look people, hyperpreterism is a cult clear & simple. I know maybe 2 people in the entire movement that I’d say have ANY sense of decency. The rest of them are thugs with an Internet connection. Most of the other decent people (such as Todd Dennis) have since left the movement & repudiate it.
John if you are reading this, you don’t need to fear for me because my friendship isn’t conditional upon people agreeing with me. Roderick was my friend before, and he will always be my friend. We were mature enough to remain friends while locking horns over doctrine. Do a search for Roderick’s name on this site for the old entries, and you will see that I was pretty hard on him, and he was on me, and we maintained a cordial relationship that whole time. I know this is uncomprehensible to some people, and I feel sorry for you if it is. Friendship is second only to marriage/family in modeling the agape love that God calls us to. It means through good times and bad times, and agreement and disagreement.
Besides, you’re STILL not a Calvinistic Christian are you Dee Dee? Shouldn’t I be fighting with you or something about that & ready to drop you?
Shsshhh. You don’t want to steal their thunder, every few months they drop the bombshell.
SHE IS NOT A CALVINIST!!!!
How does Samuel deal with the fact that his “dear brother” told me that the one thing he has always liked about me was that I was not a Calvinist. Whoops. But I am not an anti-Calvinist unlike Samuel’s “dear brother” who as a hobby likes to dig up unpleasant facts about Calvin. He brags about it on his profile.